User talk:Urwumpe

Vandals

Hi. There has been quite a lot of vandalism. I have reverted as much as I can. I have set up a category - Category:pages requiring admin attention, in which I have listed all the culprits I could find. Please can you ban them. --GW_Simulations 00:09, 1 April 2006 (MSD)

Sorry that it took so long, can't those vandals just wait until i have enjoyed my social life for today. :( They are now banned and i hope the night will be calm... --Urwumpe 03:04, 1 April 2006 (MSD)

Administrators

Hi. I was wondering what the Orbiterwiki policy on applying for adminship was? Can you help? Thanks: --GW_Simulations_{Talk | Contribs | E-mail} 00:38, 17 May 2006 (MSD)

Spam Blacklist

I can't quite work out how this works. Please can you add "http://dvd.1golod.org/" to it. --GW_Simulations_{Talk | Contribs | E-mail} 16:02, 16 July 2006 (MSD)

You can assume that all hosts domains looking like 1(...).org are only registered for the purpose of spamming, so you can simply block the whole domain on the spam blacklist by adding a line:

<URL>1golod\.org

thats all. Urwumpe 16:47, 16 July 2006 (MSD)

Solar System Template Edit Comments

The comment I believe you were looking for was:

Moving in other dwarf planets.

Not...

If you edit the template to fit to this bad example of a definition, please do it correctly.

which seems to suggest no-one should do anything if it's not total. Which is a bit daft for a wiki.

HTH, HAND. etc. --BadWolf 05:33, 25 August 2006 (MSD)

Well, if i really followed the definition, we have no planets left - even jupiter has not "cleaned its orbital neighbourhood." I changed the template to fit to the official interpretation of the rules accepted by the remaining 450 scientists in prague, but i think if this definition survives 2006, something is very wrong.

And my tone was just a reply on the "Hurray, pluto is no longer a planet" - tone. If its not neutral enough for your taste, please keep on complaining about my character... --Urwumpe 18:47, 25 August 2006 (MSD)

Jupiter has cleaned its neighbourhood very well. It even cleans ours. As for your comments, admonishing an editor for incompleteness is different to celebrating a triumph of common sense. If, however, you want sole editing rights, just say so, and stop complaining about us mere mortals in edit summaries... --BadWolf 20:50, 25 August 2006 (MSD)

Can you have an example where jupiter influenced the spatial density of objects around its orbit in a way, which you can't find on a smaller scale on pluto? If thats the definition of cleaning its neighbourhood.

And you can have as many editing rights as you want to have. And no, i don't agree to "triumph of common sense" and i hope you don't plan to use this term in an article. Common sense was the old August 16 definition. It was clear, did not rely on either subjective or redundant qualities (cleaning its orbit or impact on spatial density of objects, which would be proportional to its mass, which is already used as limit for the sphere shape). Thats not common sense, and if you would create such a definition as student on university, your professor would usually academically kill you for that. --Urwumpe 21:19, 25 August 2006 (MSD)

Oh, you want to argue about the definition? I thought you were simply slagging off users. My mistake.

Jupiter is the single greatest contributor to the planetery system. Without it all Solar models would be broken. To suggest it doesn't dominate the region it occupies is madness verging on blindness. US politicians and self-taught experts might not understand what's been agreed, but the logic is perfect: Pluto clearly isn't a planet, how do we define planet so as to make it not so? We don't want hundreds of planets. When I say 'exta-solar planetary systems' I don't mean the equivalent of Pluto, Sedna, Ceres and the like. Half the accretion disc would qualify otherwise.

My editing rights are a matter for policy. It's not your position to lecture me as to what they are when they fall within that, thank you.--BadWolf 03:37, 27 August 2006 (MSD)

But thats not the definition. Where in the new definition stands "dominates space by its gravity"? Also, that is again a subjective attribute as long as you don't define a hard value, like eg, "has more mass than 1% of the solar system." Also, where is the domination of space of mercury or mars? There are only very few asteroid belt objects, which are affected by mars gravity, while most have their orbits dominated by resonances with jupiter. And its very hard to ignore something like Jupiter even at the end of the kuiper belt - but because of the pretty small solar gravity potential in that region, even neptune is a major disturbance factor for KBO objects.

And please: Don't try to get as aggressive on other users here. I don't mind if you try to draw discussions with me to the personal level(slagging off, "immortals"), but don't even think about trying the same with others. This is not the Orbiter IRC.--Urwumpe 14:59, 27 August 2006 (MSD)

Damn, I must have forgotton to press save when I typed my reply. In summary:

1) The definition is that it cleans the area around its orbit, which is implicitly by gravity. Do you see thousands of chunks of ex-accretion disc hanging around Mercury or Mars between the Lagrange points? No. Do you around Pluto? Yes.

2) Yes, it's nebulous. It's meant to be. This isn't for scientists, their work is not affected in any way, it's about dictionaries and the general public. When scientists say 'planet' to another scientist, they know they don't mean space chunks like Pluto, Ceres et al. but Joe Public does. Dictionary definitions are rarely non-negotiable and this is often a Good Thing.

3) You threaten me on the basis of mudslinging, yet it is you with your hands caked in mud? This is not M6.

4) What has IRC got to do with it? You imply I routinely attack other users therein? See 3).

I had high hopes for OrbiterWiki, but it seems it's turning into a space encyclopedia. We don't actually need that, we have Wikipedia. And moreso it's turning into a private one where editors are attacked by administrators for, um, editing.--BadWolf 16:54, 27 August 2006 (MSD)

1) Between the lagrange points of pluto? There is most likely nothing - currently. We can't observe things smaller than Nix and Hades (which are currently labelled moons of pluto) yet. What about mercury crosser asteroids, or near mars objects? What about NEOs?

2) If you want to go that level, you can also just say, that its completly irrelevant how we call pluto or how many planets the solar system has. But if it would be like that simple for astronomers, we wouldn't have such a decision. We got the current definition because planet has to be so much different to a dwarf planet or something else. So, a planet according to the new definition will always have "cleared his neighbourhood" when you say, object x is a planet. Which implies that there is a observeable difference. Which does not exist for most planets - look at neptune.

The earlier definition was much better in that case, because it did not rely on subjective or fuzzy terms. It was clear and simple, used logically independent rules - like you should expect as the result of a scientific process. Or was it all about astrology?

3) I only tell you what you can expect if you try to do similar discussion styles with other users on other talk pages. If you attack me, thats my personal problem. If you attack others here, that will become an admin problem. If you attack others on my talk page, you can complain about massive censorship - because i will plainly delete it.

4) Yes, you like to argue until somebody cries. I have been often and long enough on IRC, remember?

So, stop getting pathetic - you had choosen the tone for the pluto edits, if you don't like others to use the same tone, stop it and be a better example. All you wanted was to degrade pluto as soon as possible, celebrated it in the wiki change log - and i answered by completing your edit, and remind you in the same changelog to do the work properly next time, as you had forgotten that the new definition was more than only the degradation of pluto. If i disturbed your celebrations, well, sue me.--Urwumpe 20:01, 27 August 2006 (MSD)

The tone is irrelevent. My celebrations weren't an attack on anyone. Your statement that I must do better work on your wiki before being allowed to contribute were. You attacked me. You know it. You now threaten me about attacking non-admins. Where's your punishment? You did exactly what you warn me not to. As if I were guilty in the first place! You like to fight, too Urwumpe. It takes two to tango. I still read M6 remember? --BadWolf 16:45, 28 August 2006 (MSD)

If you remember M6, i can only repeat it: No personal attacks against other users. My formulation in the changelog was not the political correct neutral form (just like your changelog entry), but it was also far away from being a personal attack (see above, why i had choosen this formulation, i hate repeating myself).

If you would have done accurate work, nobody would have said or done anything against your celebration - but you didn't. All you did was on the edge to be called vandalism. If the now-official terminology would not have been on your side, you would have gotten a VAND1 warning - just like every aganda-driven vandalism, in any wiki i know. But all what you did was celebrating sloppy work, so i corrected the sloppiness and stopped the celebrations for it.--Urwumpe 18:41, 28 August 2006 (MSD)

My change was not incorrect. It was however incomplete. Urwumpe, you're losing the plot if you think that's even close to vandalism! It's normal wiki editing. In what way did you stop the celebrations? By being rude and insulting as you were? That is a personal attack in my book. Physician heal thyself!

Face it, you were upset at the sensible downgrading of Pluto, didn't like the fact I was finally able to take out Pluto, and decided to be rude and insulting to me. Then, when I politely jibed you above about your rude corrections, you accuse me of a personal attack against you and threaten me with your admin privaleges. It's laughable. Sadly it will probably now cause me to stop contributing to this wiki, you don't have many editors as it is. I hope the owner reads this exchange and sees how you encourage contributors. --BadWolf 20:00, 28 August 2006 (MSD)